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nero THE zero
05-30-2013, 04:25 PM
(Rotoworld)The Texans and RE Antonio Smith have mutual interest in a contract extension.
From Rotoworld (http://www.rotoworld.com/sports/nfl/football):
Smith, entering his age-32 season, has one year left on his deal, and he currently counts $9.5 million against the cap. Smith hasn't missed a game in seven seasons. He and LE J.J. Watt make up one of the best end tandems in the league. The Texans are right up against the cap, so a camp extension could knock his number down and give the team some breathing room.

And Tania Ganguli (https://twitter.com/taniaganguli/status/340200478166110208)

PapaL
05-30-2013, 04:38 PM
This is news? Oh oh oh offseason. Right. My bad.

mussop
05-30-2013, 06:16 PM
The Texans are right up against the cap, so a camp extension could knock his number down and give the team some breathing room.


YES! Sign a real NT with that money. :peek:

Lucky
05-30-2013, 06:31 PM
YES! Sign a real NT with that money. :peek:

A legit RT would be a better investment, I think. Why didn't this extension happen earlier in the offseason?

ArlingtonTexan
05-30-2013, 06:45 PM
Not sure I am fan of this, outside of clearing short term cap space. The Antonio smiths of the world are the type of nice to pretty good players that a team should not want on its cap later in their career.

CretorFrigg
05-30-2013, 10:03 PM
Isn't that what they told Mario Williams? They were "interested" in resigning him?

bckey
05-30-2013, 10:40 PM
Isn't that what they told Mario Williams? They were "interested" in resigning him?

Yeah but $100 million changed that real quick. And realistically the Texans knew they probably wouldn't be able to afford him and knew he wasn't worth near what the Bills were offering. Antonio shouldn't cost too much to extend. If for some reason he wants a big payday for what will most likely be his last contract then the Texans will let him walk.

Corrosion
05-30-2013, 10:49 PM
#capspace :specnatz:

Brisco_County
05-31-2013, 01:29 AM
If you consider Rick Smith's 20/70/10 philosophy (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1969659), the question is if Antonio fits into Rick's top ten, or group A. If not, then he will be offered considerably less than his current contract.

badboy
05-31-2013, 08:24 AM
IMO no reason to do this UNLESS they have a FA target. They are under cap now by a bit so no urgency otherwise. June 1st cut maybe?

DocBar
05-31-2013, 11:11 AM
IMO no reason to do this UNLESS they have a FA target. They are under cap now by a bit so no urgency otherwise. June 1st cut maybe?Getting Cushing signed to a contract extension using the $$ freed up by extending Smith is the best reason I see, but only if the numbers work out over the long term.

Signing Cush now could save the team tons of cash next year or the possibility of losing him to FA. There are lots of unknowns with Cush coming off of the ACL injury, but it seems reasonable to assume he will return to form rather than suffer a drop off in performance. Nobody will ever out try Cush. They might match him, but they won't out do him.:d:

badboy
05-31-2013, 12:14 PM
Getting Cushing signed to a contract extension using the $$ freed up by extending Smith is the best reason I see, but only if the numbers work out over the long term.

Signing Cush now could save the team tons of cash next year or the possibility of losing him to FA. There are lots of unknowns with Cush coming off of the ACL injury, but it seems reasonable to assume he will return to form rather than suffer a drop off in performance. Nobody will ever out try Cush. They might match him, but they won't out do him.:d:Why extend Smith for Cushng if the $9.5 cap hit from Smith leaves with Smith after this season? Now if they want Smith for longer than this season at lower price, cool but different issue. If afraid of losing Cush we can redo Smith anytime. I am hoping they have another target and it should be substantial.

IBleedTexans
05-31-2013, 12:25 PM
Why extend Smith for Cushng if the $9.5 cap hit from Smith leaves with Smith after this season? Now if they want Smith for longer than this season at lower price, cool but different issue. If afraid of losing Cush we can redo Smith anytime. I am hoping they have another target and it should be substantial.

If he's telling the Texans he wants to retire a Texan , then surely he is willing to play for a hometown discount right ? He just lost all his leverage if not ...

Like 610 was saying this morning , he has seen that the Nfl is no longer giving big contracts to older FA ie. Freeny and the guy formally of tha Falcons

Ps I did call u Sherly lol

Double Barrel
05-31-2013, 12:36 PM
Smith hasn't missed a game in seven seasons. He and LE J.J. Watt make up one of the best end tandems in the league.

Is this true?

My perception here, as I thought Smith under-achieved last season when J.J. was getting so much attention from opposing offenses. Smith should have had a greater impact as a result. JMO

thunderkyss
05-31-2013, 12:45 PM
Is this true?

My perception here, as I thought Smith under-achieved last season when J.J. was getting so much attention from opposing offenses. Smith should have had a greater impact as a result. JMO

No. Smith has been great the last two years. Consider he's a DT, not a DE. He had great numbers for a DT or your traditional 3-4 DE, which he plays.

Those numbers from a true DE, a 4-3 DE, or the way JjWatt plays his position, wouldn't be anything to write home about. But as an interior player, which Smith is, Watt is not (except on passing downs) Smith had a very solid season. He's basically playing Warren Sapp's position.

The Pencil Neck
05-31-2013, 12:53 PM
Is this true?

My perception here, as I thought Smith under-achieved last season when J.J. was getting so much attention from opposing offenses. Smith should have had a greater impact as a result. JMO

Antonio Smith is a beast and he has been playing great football. From a comparison standpoint, he looks like a slacker compared to JJ but... EVERYONE looks like a slacker compared to JJ. For his position, Smith has been putting up great numbers.

He's a great player and I don't want to lose him anytime soon.

Double Barrel
05-31-2013, 01:05 PM
No. Smith has been great the last two years. Consider he's a DT, not a DE. He had great numbers for a DT or your traditional 3-4 DE, which he plays.

Those numbers from a true DE, a 4-3 DE, or the way JjWatt plays his position, wouldn't be anything to write home about. But as an interior player, which Smith is, Watt is not (except on passing downs) Smith had a very solid season. He's basically playing Warren Sapp's position.

Antonio Smith is a beast and he has been playing great football. From a comparison standpoint, he looks like a slacker compared to JJ but... EVERYONE looks like a slacker compared to JJ. For his position, Smith has been putting up great numbers.

He's a great player and I don't want to lose him anytime soon.

Don't get me wrong, I like Antonio Smith and hope the Texans keep him, as well.

I guess I was just kinda' surprised to see them described as "best end tandems in the league". But then again, just about anyone with J.J. Watt would be in the running since J.J. is such a phenom.

I guess my perception is that Antonio should have been even more of an impact with J.J. taking up so much attention on the other side. There were times last season when opposing QBs looked like they were getting too much time in the pocket. And with J.J. getting double, and even triple teamed, there should have been more consistent pressure on the pocket.

HOU-TEX
05-31-2013, 01:09 PM
Is this true?

My perception here, as I thought Smith under-achieved last season when J.J. was getting so much attention from opposing offenses. Smith should have had a greater impact as a result. JMO

Possibly. Or, and to be honest I haven't cued in on this, they concentrated on both Smith and Watt? More proof showing how poor out OLB play was by not winning one on ones. I know for a fact ( just me re-watching games) that Barwin couldn't win one on ones to save his life. When your OLBs stink like that, opposing Olines would roll protection to our two big boys inside.

Just a thought

Texn4life
05-31-2013, 01:28 PM
I also think Antonio was playing hurt much of last year. He had that ankle injury week 1, and then his play kind of suffered for a while.

I'd like to see something worked out, but for a reasonable amount and length. Its no need to really clear up a ton of space this year since we really aren't going to adding any big names. There aren't any left.

thunderkyss
05-31-2013, 01:39 PM
And with J.J. getting double, and even triple teamed, there should have been more consistent pressure on the pocket.

Truth is that both Jj & Antonio were getting double teamed on just about every snap & that's what made the lack of an outside rush unacceptable.

Double Barrel
05-31-2013, 02:36 PM
Possibly. Or, and to be honest I haven't cued in on this, they concentrated on both Smith and Watt? More proof showing how poor out OLB play was by not winning one on ones. I know for a fact ( just me re-watching games) that Barwin couldn't win one on ones to save his life. When your OLBs stink like that, opposing Olines would roll protection to our two big boys inside.

Just a thought

Truth is that both Jj & Antonio were getting double teamed on just about every snap & that's what made the lack of an outside rush unacceptable.

Good points. The rest of the team has to step up to take advantage of those opportunities when J.J. and Smith are both locked up or misdirected out of the play.

Hopefully Cushing comes back in full health and in full force. I really think he will make the difference and give opposing offenses fits trying to defend against him, Cushing, and Smith. OLB's have to be better this year, though, without a doubt.

The Pencil Neck
05-31-2013, 04:02 PM
Truth is that both Jj & Antonio were getting double teamed on just about every snap & that's what made the lack of an outside rush unacceptable.

^^^ This.

Our OLBs should have been CRUSHING teams. In THIS defense? With the job responsibilities OLBs have in it? With the Ninja and JJ getting the attention they were getting? There was just no excuse for someone not to come free on almost every play except maybe when the offense was in max-protect.

ArlingtonTexan
05-31-2013, 04:08 PM
^^^ This.

Our OLBs should have been CRUSHING teams. In THIS defense? With the job responsibilities OLBs have in it? With the Ninja and JJ getting the attention they were getting? There was just no excuse for someone not to come free on almost every play except maybe when the offense was in max-protect.

I think the staff did not like what they got from outside either considering two draft picks on OLBs. Now that's different than expecting them to just walk into a starting line-up of a play-off caliber team, but the Texans clearly thought that more bodies/talent/production was needed at the spot.

thunderkyss
05-31-2013, 04:33 PM
^^^ This.

Our OLBs should have been CRUSHING teams. In THIS defense? With the job responsibilities OLBs have in it? With the Ninja and JJ getting the attention they were getting? There was just no excuse for someone not to come free on almost every play except maybe when the offense was in max-protect.

Even then, we were seeing RBs & TEs block very effectively against our OLBs one on one & we shouldn't. RBs like to cut block & I know pass rushers hate that.

But put a TE or a RB one on one with Ware or Bloodline & see what happens. I'm not expecting our guys to play like those two on every play, but every once in a while would be nice. There shouldn't be a TE in the league who could stand up to Connor's strength & he kept saying Brooks was stronger. I didn't see it.

thunderkyss
05-31-2013, 04:40 PM
He's freak'n huge

http://www1.picturepush.com/photo/a/6588934/img/Houston-Texans-Wallpapers/Connor-Barwin-wall-week-2.jpg


& look at that wingspan, if he could get his body on a TE, he should be able to bench press that guy into next week, of if he could get one of those long arms under his opponents reach, he should be able to swim by them & create enormous separation. Then he can jump over a man from a stand... no running start like he did to get that penalty on special teams.

His performance last year made no sense to me.... a contract year. Maybe his knew coaches will be able to unlock all that God given ability, but for whatever reason, Wade, Kolar, & Hearing couldn't.

amazing80
06-02-2013, 06:04 PM
Ive been banging this drum since the off-season began. It seems like a no brainier to extend Antonio to free up space and keep him around longer. DL can play longer so extending him until he is 35 or 36 is not a crazy idea and would allow us to convert a good chunk of this years salary into bonus thus really lowering our cap hit this season.

steelbtexan
06-03-2013, 07:47 AM
Not sure I am fan of this, outside of clearing short term cap space. The Antonio smiths of the world are the type of nice to pretty good players that a team should not want on its cap later in their career.

Yep

Re-signing Smith to an extention is a bad idea, almost of Schaubian extention proportions. Especially with Watt and Cushing FA on the horizon.

ObsiWan
06-03-2013, 10:10 AM
Yep

Re-signing Smith to an extention is a bad idea, almost of Schaubian extention proportions. Especially with Watt and Cushing FA on the horizon.

How can you declare this a "bad idea" when no one knows what the numbers (length & $$/yr) will be??

There's no way he'll get a Schaub-level extension (money-level, I mean) because DT/DE hybrids just don't make that kind of $$. The guys over at BattleRedBlog (http://www.battleredblog.com/2013/5/31/4383292/houston-texans-antonio-smith-contract-extension-salary-cap) are thinking this level of money...

With all that in mind, I think Antonio is looking at about a three-year extension worth about $4-5M a year. When added with his current owed money, (http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/houston-texans/antonio-smith/) I think he'll see some of this salary converted into a signing bonus to help cap relief now. The extension I'd lock in at is three years for $13M with $5.75M guaranteed. It's not a crazy number, it's a nice show of loyalty to a hard-working veteran, and it doesn't hinder you from making a cap casualty cut if he declines drastically in two or three years. It's a win-win move on both sides.

That doesn't sound outrageous to me.

...unless you're thinking of low-balling Ninja to set the stage to low-ball Cush and J.J. when their time comes.

Playoffs
06-03-2013, 10:25 AM
Is this true?

My perception here, as I thought Smith under-achieved last season when J.J. was getting so much attention from opposing offenses. Smith should have had a greater impact as a result. JMO

Smiff was rated 6th/24 3-4 DEs in 2012 and 8th/32 in 2011 by PFF (http://www.profootballfocus.com/).

He is is much better against the pass versus the run, rated 2nd in both 2012 & 2011.

thunderkyss
06-03-2013, 11:19 AM
Yep

Re-signing Smith to an extention is a bad idea, almost of Schaubian extention proportions. Especially with Watt and Cushing FA on the horizon.

It depends on how they structure it.

He's due $9M this year, which is his cap hit. We can turn $6M of that into a signing bonus over 5 years & his cap hit will drop to $4.2M. Over the remaining 4 years, his cap hit will be the $1.2M plus incentives, plus whatever you make his salary. We can cut him after 2 years if need be (but I doubt we'll need to) & it will cost us $3.6M, after 3 years $2.4M, after 4 years $1.2M

I like Antonio & I think he's worth $4-5M/yr against our cap for the next 5 years so I wouldn't have a problem with an extension like that.

Of course, even though I do not like Schaub, I think he's worth the $11M he's costing our cap, which doesn't even put him in the top 10 (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1593808-the-impact-quarterback-inflation-has-on-the-nfl-salary-cap) of QB caphits of 2013.

But we're tied to him for another year..... whaaaaa... 12 wins. 4000 yards. Whaaaa....

Dutchrudder
06-03-2013, 01:21 PM
How can you declare this a "bad idea" when no one knows what the numbers (length & $$/yr) will be??

There's no way he'll get a Schaub-level extension (money-level, I mean) because DT/DE hybrids just don't make that kind of $$. The guys over at BattleRedBlog (http://www.battleredblog.com/2013/5/31/4383292/houston-texans-antonio-smith-contract-extension-salary-cap) are thinking this level of money...


That doesn't sound outrageous to me.

...unless you're thinking of low-balling Ninja to set the stage to low-ball Cush and J.J. when their time comes.

Why on earth would Antonio sign that deal? He could do much better on the free market next year, assuming he doesn't have a big injury. 4.33m a year average would put him in the range of guys like Ray Macdonald, Mike Devito, Jason Babin and Osi Umenyoria. The 5.75 guaranteed is pretty low, and is less than the salary he supposed to make this year. He could do better than that.

I think if he were to hit the open market right now, he would get somewhere in the range of 3 years 18-20m. He's worth about 6m a year to a 3-4 team, assuming he doesn't take a nosedive this year. He restructured his deal to help the team a couple years ago, and now his 2013 cap hit is a bit higher than it should be. The Texans need a bit more capspace to finish signing rookies, so this is the logical choice to free up some cash. I just hope they don't overpay the guy and regret it for the next 4 years.

badboy
06-26-2013, 03:17 PM
This from Tania Ganguli June 25th basically saying extend Antonio Smith. IMO, we have $3m under cap and no evidence of anyone on radar. Why extend when we do not have to? I like Smith but hopefully one of the younger guys will be ready to go by 2014. Smith's $9m hit would go well to Cush if he gets even that much. We have plenty of time to decide what to do with Brian, especially to allow him to show what he has.

http://bleacherreport.com/tb/daGVR?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_campaign=houston-texans


If they gave Antonio Smith a four-year extension through 2017, they could lower his 2013 cap number significantly just by reducing his base salary to the minimum — $840,000 for someone with eight years experience — and making up the remaining $5.16 million in a signing bonus. He would receive the full signing bonus up front, thus not impacting his cash flow for the year, but the amount of the signing bonus that counts against the salary cap would be evenly split over the length of the contract.

That $3.5 million pro-rated amount from his original contract would still count in his cap number for 2013. But even carrying that number and adding it to the new pro-rated amount and his base salary, the Texans would reduce his cap figure by about $4 million with this plan.

The Pencil Neck
06-26-2013, 03:34 PM
This from Tania Ganguli June 25th basically saying extend Antonio Smith. IMO, we have $3m under cap and no evidence of anyone on radar. Why extend when we do not have to? I like Smith but hopefully one of the younger guys will be ready to go by 2014.

Maybe because we like him, expect him to keep performing at a high level, and want to keep him on our team for longer?

badboy
06-26-2013, 03:39 PM
Maybe because we like him, expect him to keep performing at a high level, and want to keep him on our team for longer?Still does not fit for me. Extend him towards end of season to avoid injury impacting a new contract. I am not saying not to extend just no reason to do it now. This is one time I am not willing to push salary to later, at least not until I see how other players do.

thunderkyss
06-26-2013, 04:10 PM
Still does not fit for me. Extend him towards end of season to avoid injury impacting a new contract. I am not saying not to extend just no reason to do it now. This is one time I am not willing to push salary to later, at least not until I see how other players do.

If not now, when? He's a FA at the end of the season. Then we're talking new contract.

DocBar
06-26-2013, 05:58 PM
Why extend Smith for Cushng if the $9.5 cap hit from Smith leaves with Smith after this season? Now if they want Smith for longer than this season at lower price, cool but different issue. If afraid of losing Cush we can redo Smith anytime. I am hoping they have another target and it should be substantial. This is why I added only if the numbers work. I would be OK with seeing how Crick does this year but other than that, the Texans are very, very light at DT depth. Are there any DT draft prospects on your radar, that will be ready to start and available at 32 in the draft, that you have your eye on? :texflag:

Lucky
06-26-2013, 06:48 PM
Justin Smithís role, age and ability could mean his contract provides benchmarks for Antonio Smithís extension with the Texans. Both Smiths are skilled 3-4 defensive ends, disruptive and in their 30s. Antonio is 31, turning 32 in October, while Justin is 34.


Consider: Before making this deal, Justin Smithís salary cap figure for 2013 was $8 million with a $7.5 million salary this season. Now the 49ers cut nearly $4.3 million off his cap figure while leaving his salary virtually unchanged for 2013. They gave him a minimum-base salary of $940,000 with a $6.56 million signing bonus and a $500,000 workout bonus.


Justin Smithís cap number does rise to $6.737 million in 2014 and $6.237 million in 2015. But that isnít astronomical. Heíll be paid $4.55 million in 2014 and $3.586 million in 2016 including base salary and roster bonuses, unless he gets released or retires.


Link (http://bleacherreport.com/tb/daGVR?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_campaign=houston-texans)

The 49ers got a screaming deal from Justin Smith. Unless he was in danger of being cut (which I highly doubt), Smith gave up free agency in 2014 for 500K. Antonio Smith will not give the Texans that kind of deal.

DocBar
06-26-2013, 06:51 PM
Link (http://bleacherreport.com/tb/daGVR?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_campaign=houston-texans)

The 49ers got a screaming deal from Justin Smith. Unless he was in danger of being cut (which I highly doubt), Smith gave up free agency in 2014 for 500K. Antonio Smith will not give the Texans that kind of deal.Justin Smith also negotiated his own extension. Smith's agent has been there and done this.

nero THE zero
06-27-2013, 07:52 AM
Link (http://bleacherreport.com/tb/daGVR?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_campaign=houston-texans)

The 49ers got a screaming deal from Justin Smith. Unless he was in danger of being cut (which I highly doubt), Smith gave up free agency in 2014 for 500K. Antonio Smith will not give the Texans that kind of deal.

I also question whether it would be wise to have Antonio carrying $6+mm cap hits for the next two years when we have Watt, Cushing and Jackson to re-sign.

With Watt on the d-line we are probably going to have to go bargain basement at the other two positions in order to have a prudent and balanced allocation of the cap.

76Texan
06-27-2013, 04:14 PM
Still does not fit for me. Extend him towards end of season to avoid injury impacting a new contract. I am not saying not to extend just no reason to do it now. This is one time I am not willing to push salary to later, at least not until I see how other players do.

It seems that the Texans normally try to wrap up all their deal deals early?!?

badboy
06-27-2013, 08:37 PM
If not now, when? He's a FA at the end of the season. Then we're talking new contract.I say never but Texans would want to wait a few games minimum to see if we can lose his $9m cap without pushing into future and bring in a younger cheaper guy. Also, Smith may want to test free agency as his last contract.

Blake
06-28-2013, 08:17 AM
Cap space now for dead money later doesn't make ANY sense to me unless you think your window is closing in the next couple of seasons. That is like paying bills with a credit card. Great! You get to keep the power on this month, but next month when the bill is due you are going to have to steal from Peter to pay Paul.

Smith may understand that his best chance at getting a "final contract" may come in the form of a Texans extension, and force him to be reasonable. But he might opt to try the FA market at 33. Who knows.

thunderkyss
06-28-2013, 08:44 AM
Smith may understand that his best chance at getting a "final contract" may come in the form of a Texans extension, and force him to be reasonable. But he might opt to try the FA market at 33. Who knows.

What's reasonable? That's what screws this whole conversation up. Antonio Smith just came off the two best seasons of his career. DL can play well into their thirties. Looking at Justin Smith we should be able to expect at least two more years from Antonio (I think).

Personally, if the Texans don't do something prior to the season starting (or shortly thereafter ala Schaub) that tells me the Texans do not have Antonio in their plans for the future. My way of thinking is that you don't let players you "need" hit free agency.

Of course if Antonio turns them down, that's another story.

So, this, "Don't sign anyone until we sign Cushing & Watt" thinking doesn't make sense to me. We're going to sign other players. As the Texans I would think they have a dollar figure at which they realize good value for Antonio Smith's services. Whatever that dollar figure is, they need to factor that into their future plans.

badboy
06-28-2013, 09:50 AM
What's reasonable? That's what screws this whole conversation up. Antonio Smith just came off the two best seasons of his career. DL can play well into their thirties. Looking at Justin Smith we should be able to expect at least two more years from Antonio (I think).

Personally, if the Texans don't do something prior to the season starting (or shortly thereafter ala Schaub) that tells me the Texans do not have Antonio in their plans for the future. My way of thinking is that you don't let players you "need" hit free agency.

Of course if Antonio turns them down, that's another story.

So, this, "Don't sign anyone until we sign Cushing & Watt" thinking doesn't make sense to me. We're going to sign other players. As the Texans I would think they have a dollar figure at which they realize good value for Antonio Smith's services. Whatever that dollar figure is, they need to factor that into their future plans.Fun and interesting discussion! Is Smith a "need" player? Not so sure as Crick $ .668, Jamison $. 840 and even Browner $ .495 for 2014 may impact keeping Antonio after 2013.

Again, I like Smith but $9.5m cap goes a long way to signing Cushing & Watt. Ninja is a good player but not a great player.

Rey
06-28-2013, 10:01 AM
I would not keep Smith anywhere near his current salary. He'd have to take a significant pay cut. Otherwise I'd let him test the market.

thunderkyss
06-28-2013, 10:48 AM
Fun and interesting discussion! Is Smith a "need" player? Not so sure as Crick $ .668, Jamison $. 840 and even Browner $ .495 for 2014 may impact keeping Antonio after 2013.

Again, I like Smith but $9.5m cap goes a long way to signing Cushing & Watt. Ninja is a good player but not a great player.

If you're planning on extending Cushing or Watt this year, yes. If not, it has no bearing. Antonio Smith is a FA in 2014. If the Texans want to keep him past 2013 they need to sign him to an extension. I would prefer they do it this year if they are going to do it. That money could be used to sign the rookies & provide some buffer for this year.

If I thought Crick, Jamison or Browner can get me 5 sacks & all the hurries & pressures that goes with it, then yes that would change whether or not we "need" Smith.

I would not keep Smith anywhere near his current salary. He'd have to take a significant pay cut. Otherwise I'd let him test the market.

His current salary is $6M. You don't think he is worth anywhere near $6M/yr? I think he's a $3-$5M per year player. I wouldn't have a problem if the Texans extended him for 4 years with a $10M signing bonus.

That would reduce his cap this year by $2-3M.

$3.5M (current prorated bonus) + $2.5M (new prorated bonus) + $800K (vet min) = 2013 cap hit

$2.5M + (vet min)= 2014 cap hit, 2015 cap hit, 2016 cap hit.

Or something like that.

The Pencil Neck
06-28-2013, 11:08 AM
To me, Smith saying he's interested in an extension is Smith saying that he doesn't want to test FA and that he's willing to sign for less. He wants to stay here.

If he's willing to be reasonable with his money requests, I'm willing to extend him.

Rey
06-28-2013, 11:15 AM
If you're planning on extending Cushing or Watt this year, yes. If not, it has no bearing. Antonio Smith is a FA in 2014. If the Texans want to keep him past 2013 they need to sign him to an extension. I would prefer they do it this year if they are going to do it. That money could be used to sign the rookies & provide some buffer for this year.

If I thought Crick, Jamison or Browner can get me 5 sacks & all the hurries & pressures that goes with it, then yes that would change whether or not we "need" Smith.



His current salary is $6M. You don't think he is worth anywhere near $6M/yr? I think he's a $3-$5M per year player. I wouldn't have a problem if the Texans extended him for 4 years with a $10M signing bonus.

That would reduce his cap this year by $2-3M.

$3.5M (current prorated bonus) + $2.5M (new prorated bonus) + $800K (vet min) = 2013 cap hit

$2.5M + (vet min)= 2014 cap hit, 2015 cap hit, 2016 cap hit.

Or something like that.


2-3 mil. Max.

We have a lot of young guys in the stable that I think are capable. Considering the guys will will have to pay I would not place a high priority on Smith.

If he wants to play for half his current salary or less then yeah...why not...

CloakNNNdagger
06-28-2013, 12:43 PM
Most very good teams try to maintain continuity by keeping some seasoned productive vets while transitioning to currently promising but definitely unproven substitutions. If negotiations allow for us squeezing in the deal, I say go for it. With so much of our lbs and secondary coming back from injuries/surgeries, at least try to keep the productive (and protective) part of the front line intact (I'm personally not sold on the Earl Mitchell love).

badboy
06-28-2013, 01:06 PM
I think there will be teams willing to pay Smith with his stats what he is earning this year $6m and offer a three year deal. If I were him I would not agree to a $3m (or less) extension. In addition, he will be playing for a new deal somewhere and if he does well or gets a ring, why not seek greener money er pastures?

badboy
06-28-2013, 01:14 PM
To me, Smith saying he's interested in an extension is Smith saying that he doesn't want to test FA and that he's willing to sign for less. He wants to stay here.

If he's willing to be reasonable with his money requests, I'm willing to extend him.

Let's say we rework him and he gets a $3m base + $1m prorated bonus or cap hit of $4m. That would be very reasonable although I doubt he would take it. You have reduced his cap hit by almost half from $9.5 to 4. While $4.5 savings is good, it does not do as much as having a full $9m to utilize. If we are considering allowing his contract to play out, we need to make sure we have a replacement for his absence in 2014. While we might surmise, it would be best to allow at least half of 2013 season to pass; no reason to do anything at this time.

ObsiWan
06-29-2013, 12:18 AM
Fun and interesting discussion! Is Smith a "need" player? Not so sure as Crick $ .668, Jamison $. 840 and even Browner $ .495 for 2014 may impact keeping Antonio after 2013.

Again, I like Smith but $9.5m cap goes a long way to signing Cushing & Watt. Ninja is a good player but not a great player.

Do you really think Cushing will be as effective with Jamison or Crick or Browner at the other DE spot as he's been with Ninja in that spot. Would Wade be able to play the move-Watt-around games he plays if Jamison/Crick/Browner in Ninja's spot.

It's not just a money thing; it's will we fundamentally weaken our defensive front by letting a very effective DE (22 sacks in the 4 yrs he's been here) walk out the door...? Keeping a solid defense for the next 2-4 years - while A.J. is still the monster he's been on offense - is worth a 3-5 mil/yr investment. I simply don't see Jamison sufficiently filling the void that Ninja would leave. And Browner and Crick are pretty much unknown quantities.
I don't care for the idea of monkeying with Wade's toys like that to save a few bucks when there are games that can be played to keep the cap hit sensible.

And, BTW, what's wrong with Cushing giving a "hometown discount"? Yeah, he's a terror when healthy but he's missed 16 games in the four years he's been here.... Ninja has missed NONE.
Just my :twocents:

thunderkyss
06-29-2013, 12:40 AM
I agree. Had Crick or Jamison shown they were ready to take Antonio's spot this would be a differnet conversation. The smart move now is to extend smith & try to trade Crick or Jamison if they can increase their perceived value.

PapaL
06-29-2013, 03:16 AM
Not sure who is coming out next year or what the field looks like but I don't see him being around that much longer.